Automated Transcript Episode 25

Episode  25: The Power of Play Therapy (Clear Sky)

Speaker Anna Hodgsin and Becky Hill

Please excuse any errors as this transcript has been automatically generated.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 00:08

Welcome to the Send Parenting Podcast. I'm your neurodiverse host, dr Olivia Kessel, and, more importantly, i'm mother to my wonderfully neurodivergent daughter, alexandra, who really inspired this podcast. As a veteran in navigating the world of neurodiversity in a UK education system, i've uncovered a wealth of misinformation, alongside many answers and solutions that were never taught to me in medical school or in any of the parenting handbooks. Each week on this podcast, i will be bringing the experts to your ears to empower you on your parenting crusade. In this episode we are going to explore the impact of play therapy and creative therapy for children's mental well-being and health. We'll be talking with ClearSky, a charity who provides those services to children aged 3 to 18, alongside providing education for families and professionals.

01:09

We'll be joined today with two guests Anna Hodgson, the captain of ClearSky, and Becky Hill, head of therapeutic thinking. I was really amazed at the impact that play therapy can have on outcomes. It's phenomenal, with a 94% success rate, 18% reduction in hyperactivity, a 24% rise in emotional well-being and a 30% reduction in peer difficulties. Please keep listening to learn more about the power of play. So welcome Anna and Becky, to the Send Parenting podcast.

01:44

It is such a pleasure to have you on the show today, i have been amazed learning more about play therapy and creative therapy and the impact it has on actual children's outcomes and how you actually can empower them to reach their potential with something that I would think kids and I know my daughter has an experience she does Lego Club but that they think they're playing and having fun. So what a win to actually do something that a child likes to do that has such an impact on them. So I am super excited to have you both on the show today And I thought we would start with Anna and I believe your title is Captain of Clear Sky, which I really like that title To tell us a little bit more about Clear Sky as a charity and what you guys offer, both in the school system and then also outside of the school.

Anna Hodgson Guest 02:32

Yeah, of course it's absolutely. It's really lovely to be here and thank you for inviting us on. It's really nice to be able to come on and just talk about what we do and Clear Sky and all the work that we're doing. So, yeah, great to be here.

02:45

Clear Sky, we're a very small children's charity based in Oxfordshire And, as you say, we provide therapeutic services for children And also we do parenting work as well and a whole bunch of other stuff, but primarily that the heart of our work is providing therapeutic services through playing creative arts to children in primary schools. We do work in some secondaries, but the heart of our work is really in primary And we work through what we call the power of play. So all of our interventions are very child led. We let the child work through their normally trauma. They've usually been referred to us through a childhood trauma or an experience or it could be an emotional or behavioral issue. So we match them up with a therapist who works with them in schools on a regular basis over a certain number of weeks And the child can work with a therapist who will go along and help support them to sort of get through what they're experiencing and go on to lead a happier life.

03:48

So we've got a whole range of different creative arts therapists who work with us. Becky, who's with us today, is our head of therapy, so she manages our entire therapy team And we've got, i think, around on our books around 20 therapists. So right across the spectrum, from play through drama, through arts, dance and movements all sorts of different specialisms. So, yeah, so we work in schools to provide support there. We've currently I think last year we worked at about 42 Oxfordshire schools, so we supported over 100 kids last year.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 04:26

And how do you get into the schools, anna? How does schools like? how does that work? you know?

Anna Hodgson Guest 04:32

Well, we've got some really loyal schools that we've worked with for many years. We don't actually advertise our playing creative arts therapy services because we are just so busy. We are really struggling to recruit any more therapists. Actually, i think we've rinsed Oxfordshire out for therapists And all of our therapists are pretty fully booked, so most of our work is self-driven. So we do have a lot of inquiries coming through on a weekly basis from schools And what we do what we try and do is match them up as best we can. As an intervention ends in one setting, we'll try and free up a therapist to go and pick up that new referral. So yeah, we do. The referrals generally come directly from schools, but schools that we know, and we will never turn a child away unless, of course, we feel that therapy isn't right for that particular child in that instance. So in that situation we would always look to signpost them somewhere else if we didn't feel that what we offer is appropriate.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 05:40

And you said the journey, how many sessions a child has. Does that kind of depend on what their challenge is and where they're going from?

Anna Hodgson Guest 05:49

Yeah, very much so. So the therapists will do some initial work with the child to assess their needs and talk to them about what sort of support we're going to give them. And obviously the other important factor is talking to the school about what's available in terms of funding. We do subsidize the cost of therapy. We fundraise ourselves. We do a lot of work on fundraising to support the charity, but we do charge a nominal fee to schools And obviously budgets are really really tight But we always look to support what the child needs. So we always say generally, a minimum of 12 sessions is appropriate. It could be 18, it could be a lot more. It just depends. Really, it's very individual and bespoke to each of the children that we're working with.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 06:32

And that's really nice that it's not a prescribed number Like if you're dealing with insurance companies or you're dealing with other plans interventions there's usually a limit, so it sounds like having that charity aspect of it really gives you a freedom to put that child really in the center of what you're doing, which is fantastic, yeah absolutely.

Anna Hodgson Guest 06:51

And I mean, as I said, the work is very child led. So the therapist, becky, will be able to tell you more about this. But the therapist works with the child to assess where they're at, how much more support they need, and then they'll work towards an ending with the child. So they'll always be. We don't just say, right, you've had your 12 weeks and that's it, we're off. It'll be very much. Be in agreement with the child, the school, the parents as to where the child is, how they're doing and whether it's appropriate for us to step away. And then there are always instances where that trauma can resurface later at certain points in time. We have some children who've transitioned to secondary, who have gone back and supported more, because those moments in life can be an upheaval for children. So we don't walk away. We're always there for just to provide follow on, support as needed. So, yeah, so that sort of fits the core of Clear Sky work.

07:45

We did about two, i think 2000 therapeutic sessions last year in schools, which was quite a lot. We're a really tiny, tiny central team. At HQ There's any well, there's five of us now, but we're all part time. So we were stretched quite thinly. But we yeah, as I said earlier, we're all a little bit mad and we kind of do everything that is presented to us. So on top of the therapeutic work, we also support parents. We run a number of parenting groups to support parents, sometimes the parents who are parents of the children that we're working with, often not often other parents who come to us through schools as a group who need some support. But we provide training for other professionals who work outside of our own network as well. So we train other playing creative arts professionals across the country to provide that parenting support as well through our parenting support programs. So, yeah, we do, we do quite a lot.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 08:43

I know you've mentioned to me before your type of parenting support programs that there's different ones, isn't there?

Anna Hodgson Guest 08:48

if my memory serves me correctly, that's right, so we have three programs that we run ourselves which are licensed programs. We have a baby bonding program, which works with expectant parents and new parents of babies and toddlers We work with. We have a parent-child attachment play program, which is to support parents, either on a one-to-one basis or as part of a group, and we have a heart-to-heart program where we work in groups with parent and child together or a pair of you know, in pairs with a parent and child. Becky will be able to tell you a great deal more about the parenting programs because she delivers the training on those. So, yeah, but they're really, really successful and lovely programs And we've trained across the UK hundreds and hundreds of professionals who deliver those in their communities. So you know, we want to be able to for families to find those professionals. We have a register on our website so people can hop on the website, search for a professional in their area and go and find a parenting program. That's brilliant.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 09:53

Becky, why don't we have you join us now in this discussion in terms of telling us a little bit more about these parenting programs? Because I know you know from my perspective, and I know many parents' perspectives you're always looking for what can you do to, especially when your child's experiencing maybe emotional and behavioral kind of challenges. They might be neurodiverse, they might have had trauma, you know whatever's in their world. You want to find tools that can help you to navigate that and to help them to get across those things in a way that's constructive. And it sounds like what you're learning on these parenting programs is kind of how to do that. Am I? am I guessing right?

Becky Hill Guest 10:29

Yeah, so the three groups are very much built upon the same theory. We essentially do the same thing in each of the three interventions but they're designed to support that different developmental stage basically, and they're kind of delivered in different ways. So baby bonding and heart to heart, we're very much hands on with play in sessions with both the parent and the child, kara and child there together. So that could be mum or dad, that could be foster Kara, it could be grandma or auntie or uncle whoever essentially is a really key role in that person, that child's life. So they're really flexible. They're all based upon building strong relationships and developing secure attachments. I think it's a really supportive message for parents and carers that there's have you heard of the studies? but like the longest study in adult development, it's gone on for like 80 years and it's still ongoing And the key thing that they found is that relationships are the biggest predictor of health. So it's not about how much money you've got, it's not about what material objects you've got. The key thing that helps children to succeed and do well is if they've got supportive and secure relationships, and that's exactly what the groups focus on. We spend a lot of time building parental headspace. So we've all got bills that we have to pay, work that we need to do, 900 other things that are going on in our heads at all times. So we spend a lot of time focusing on grounding and allowing parents to just focus on the child. I say parent, i mean Kara parent Yeah, it's changeably when I say that word, just to be clear. So on that, for allowing parents to create that headspace, we also work a lot on emotional regulation And a really important message when we're thinking about children who are neurodiverse is that we get that.

12:23

Emotional regulation doesn't always look like sitting down and breathing, you know I I think it's really cool. I get referred a lot of children with ADHD and they are super high energy often And the groups in the early stages can, from an outside eye, perhaps look a bit chaotic. So we're moving all over the space And in time if we can just accept that and, you know, regulate ourselves in time, the children also regulate around us And we go from having these early weeks where everyone's jumping in on each other And we're doing like really high energy movement, because the children need to let this energy out and find ways to regulate it and movement is an incredible way to allow that. And then we get to week six or seven and we have children in the space who are reaching out to their peers when they feel they can notice that someone's anxious and they can openly say that, and the parents are just like, wow, i don't, i don't get to see this space because it's you know, it's so fast moving. And so we have those elements creating the emotional regulation for parent and child, as well as creating headspace for the parent, as well as focusing on, like, key relationship skills.

13:37

Something really important about the groups is that we aren't teaching parents anything. I'm not a parent myself and I make that really clear. You know, the parents that I'm working with know more about their children than I do and can educate me on their child way more than I can. So I'm going to share some evidence-based tools and they can use them in whatever way works for their family. But something really important that all three of our programs is based on is called reflective functioning. I don't know if that's something that you've heard of before.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 14:07

I haven't heard of reflective functioning. No, please educate me.

Becky Hill Guest 14:10

Okay, awesome I'm aware I'm really talking. I'm very passionate about these groups.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 14:13

Excellent.

Becky Hill Guest 14:14

Heart to Heart is my favorite intervention. I love it. They're all awesome, but Heart to Heart is quite a high-energy, movement-based group, so I really love it. Reflective functioning is essentially a way of being or a style of communication. It was a term coined by Peter Vonnegut, for anyone who wants to look further into it, but it relates to all sorts of theories like mind-mindedness, and we use all sorts of ways to share it with people.

14:40

So behavior meaning feeling and supporting essentially supporting people to understand what's going on in the internal world of the other person. So we share it in three stages, called head, heart and hands, and we actively do this in groups because it's the capacity to practice reflective functioning has been the key thing found in security-attached relationships. So if there's one thing we can get when we end these groups, it's for the parents to have taken this skill away from them. So the first thing is to literally be able to watch and wonder what's going on in your child's head, and we do that by playing and just watching them play and just gently sitting by and allowing them to explore. And the second is feeling. So the heart. So wondering what's going on in your child's heart, what feelings are experiencing. And the last is letting them know about it.

15:35

So we talked about relationships being the key thing for health long-term, and something really important is knowing that people understand you and knowing that people know what's going on in your internal world. So that last bit is about letting them know. So it could be a child scores a goal and we see it. We see, okay, what's going on. They scored a goal, what are they feeling? they're really tough, they're super excited, and then that passing back bit is oh my goodness, you did it. Look at that, you're so happy And it's that part that, essentially, research has said is the most soothing thing. So it's not about being perfect. It's not about everything going really, really well. It's not about children succeeding in school, as you know, whatever that might look like, it's about them being understood and accepted.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 16:22

I think that sounds absolutely amazing and I think it is, i think, one of the biggest challenges you have, because maybe you are putting, as a parent, what you want to happen and you're not actually pausing and understanding what's going on in the child's head at that moment and you're just frustrated and so you're not fitting into their internal world and you're not able to reflect that and instead you put up a barrier and it's. You know, we live in busy times, we expect certain things from our children and it just hits a wall. So what you've said there is incredibly simple, but probably hard to execute all the time. So how do you teach parents to do this? I mean, it's easy if it's a goal which is really positive, and it's really easy to do that. But when it's a meltdown or when the behavior isn't you know the way you would like your child to be at that moment, how do you tap into them and use that kind of the tools you were just discussing?

Becky Hill Guest 17:17

Sure.

17:18

So this is partly why we build headspace and emotional regulation into sessions, because we can't when our cups are really full and when we're dysregulated, we can't practice reflective functioning, we don't have the capacity for it, it's just totally out of the window.

17:33

So I mean there is always a positive safeguarding message for any parent carer, which is that if we're feeling super stressed, we need to step away for a moment and take some grounded breaths before we go back and respond. I think it's also really important to note and I was saying to Anna before we came on I don't have children. I have four nieces, so I absolutely adore and spend a lot of time with and looking after, and there's a big difference between the way I respond to my nieces when things go wrong and the way that I respond at work, because our personal are very, very different And it's really important to note that One of the biggest things and I was going to say this as a tip, but one of the things parents take away from the groups is that the psychology tells us we only need to be good enough to create secure attachments with our children And that good enough only needs to be for quite a small percentage of the time.

18:29

So it's around 28 to 30%, which is amazing, right? That's such a good thing. You can get things wrong and it's not the end of the world So long as it's a tolerable failure. We're talking, our child has a meltdown and we shout back. But the key thing there is that if we can repair it, if we can, as adults, take the owners to go, do you know what? actually my child is still learning and developing and they need me to come back now and say do you know what? I asked you not to shout and I shouted at you and I'm sorry, because that's not what's helpful to you in those moments. And then we go okay, we're back again, we're attuned with one another and things are all right, and actually this is what develops resilience in children. So I guess the message is it's not always going to go right and that's all right, because actually children bounce back from it and they learn then that, okay, i fell out with my friend on the playground, but maybe I can go and say sorry and things will be okay.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 19:26

Yeah, you can almost model how you can get back from those moments. Another question that's popping into my head is let's say you are keeping your calm and you're being you know, you've tapped into that inner strength, but your child's having the meltdown and you're trying to understand what's going on in their inner world. That's you know, and sometimes it's not clear. It's as clear as mud. How do you tap into your child's inner world?

Becky Hill Guest 19:51

Yeah, I guess something really important to note is that, like when children are flooded with cortisol and like when their fight flight is triggered, we're not going to be able to soothe them immediately. And that's not like defeatist, it's not being like, oh, there's no change. But if they get repeat experiences of us being there and waiting and creating a safe space around them and then soothing them afterwards and reflecting, we know that in time those behaviors might reduce.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 20:22

That makes it, when you're in that kind of fight or flight whether it be you or your child you're not hearing anything. So, getting to that calm kind of place, my daughter and I we have this pause on a plan thing and we've both filled it out with like little bubbles which say okay, when I lose it, what do I do? So for me, i go walk in the garden and smell the lavender. My daughter might go and pet the dog or jump in the trampoline, so just ways to get us from that moment to a calmer moment. And then you know, and then can go forward from there in a more constructive way.

Becky Hill Guest 20:51

Yeah, and we have co-regulation right. I love that, by the way, as well, and so that's something really important. That sometimes is missing from therapy is that it's so child led that we actually need to build in the. Well, what do we do if? because we can be aware of ourselves, but we do have to build in the? actually, i need to be aware of the things that help me to feel calm or when I feel angry, i can do X to help me reduce that feeling.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 21:15

It makes my daughter feel like, okay, it's not just me doing it, you're doing it too, mommy. And she'll even say to me like if I'm like just brush your teeth, she'll go mommy, i think you need to go smell some lavender. So you know, it's like we're in it together versus you know, i'm just asking her to do these things.

Becky Hill Guest 21:33

Yeah, and we're just firing it together because co-regulation tells us that if we stay calm generally, the children in our presence will also remain calm. If we get really anxious, they're going to feel that energy. Regardless of whether we think we're showing it, they'll pick up on it. And children are really intuitive, right. So they do feel it and do pick up on it. And I guess in those moments, if a child's having a really hard time, i think the first thing to do is to take a step back yourself and try and regulate your own nervous system, because I mean, i've been in experiences.

22:09

I started working with children when I was 18, 70, 18, 18. And I worked in a special educational needs school and children would have scorned and my immediate response at that time would be to run after them And that wasn't what they needed. I was mirroring them, i was picking up on their energy. Where it's actually, if I could just breathe for a moment and go, it's okay, just watch and wonder and see what might happen, they can pick up that energy and just try and hold and contain them with your emotions. So I think if you're watching your child and they're having a really difficult moment, just taking a moment to breathe yourself first and then just go through those three steps. What's going on for them? What happened just before this? maybe to bring us here? Then we might be able to think about how they're feeling.

22:59

Okay, so they're feeling really distressed. I can see they're super distressed, and then we can to let them know. We can just sit and say I'm here and I can see you're really distressed. Right now I'm not going to ask anything of you. If you can let me know what you need, that would be amazing. But for now I'm just going to be here. I'm not going to leave you, i'm not going to go anywhere And even just practicing breathing near them so that they can hear that regulation and then be watching. For you know, little, small little things that might be an invitation, like whether it's hitting a ball. Okay, maybe we're being invited to bring a bit of movement in so that we can re-regulate.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 23:34

That's brilliant. That's so simple but so powerful. you know of how to navigate, what can escalate, you know, and doesn't do anyone any good, so that is really brilliant. So it also sounds like you're at these groups. Is it primarily in primary school or do you also do it with, like, teenagers Because that's, you know, puberty and all of those fun times and the hormones and stuff like that. Are these heart to heart also for when you're hitting teenage groups, and how do you get teenagers to get bought into playing creative therapy?

Becky Hill Guest 24:16

Yeah, So we do creative arts therapy in secondary as well as offering these groups. So we've got some heart to heart groups going on in secondary schools at the minute. So a big part of the sessions as well is actually about developmental information. So we know that huge changes are going on in the teenage brain and it's actually a really incredible time in development. There's so much to be harnessed in teenage brains and you know, they're actually really, really inspirational if we can again, as parents, take a step back and regulate and be there to support.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 25:47

Yeah, exactly that's what I'm afraid of. My daughter is still 11, so I've still got that to look forward to. But, boy, i was a naughty teenager.

Becky Hill Guest 25:56

So it's an awesome psychologist, dan Siegel, and he does some great videos on the teenage brain and what's going on and how to respond to parents. if anyone sort of wants more information on that too, That's excellent.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 26:10

I think it's. You know, it's such an interesting time, as you say, with a teenager's brain and it's also such a stressful time because they have these GCSEs, they're trying to fit in with their peer group. It's a perfect maelstrom of stuff that's going on, so they need to be supported and appreciated and to understand that. As you say, it also can be an amazing time in terms, and you look at some of the teenagers out there and what they're doing with the environment and other things. They're really I don't know. They seem to be so much more evolved than when I was a teenager long, long time ago.

Anna Hodgson Guest 26:42

I think the thing is as well that we expect teenagers to be adults, we expect them to be grown up by that point and we kind of expect them to be sensible and organised and be able to cope with everything. and actually their brains are really, really in a mush at that point, aren't they? They're having to cope with a lot, as you say.

Becky Hill Guest 27:01

I make big life decisions as well, there's a lot of pressure to make big life decisions when the research tells us that the brain is a teenage brain until 25. Which is, yeah, it's quite it's late, but by that point we've already potentially done our studying and had to make a career choice. and there's this pressure to you know, an additional pressure that really teens don't need to be ready to be an adult so early.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 27:30

It's almost like you're.

Anna Hodgson Guest 27:30

Yeah, and there's also the sorry.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host27:32

No, go ahead then.

Anna Hodgson Guest 27:32

Sorry, i was just going to say there's also the interesting thing about, you know, teenage sleep isn't there. You know that we get it so wrong in this country with the education system. You know that kids, you know, the best sleep is sort of that early stage in the morning, and yet we've got them in school, kind of expecting them to perform at half past eight, nine o'clock when they're just not ready. It's a lot to take on.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 27:55

It is a lot to take on and you know, if you think about how long we're living now, is there really a rush to be all sorted out. By the time we're 24, 25 years of age. You know, People are living to 100 plus, you know. So there's no rush, There's no rush.

Anna Hodgson Guest 28:10

A long time to be at work isn't there, Which is why it's super important to find something you're passionate about.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 28:18

You know, like I can hear your guys is passionate about this, and you know it's really important to find something in life where it doesn't feel like work. You enjoy what you're doing and you're passionate about it, whatever that is. You know, and I think sometimes we forget that in terms of our career counseling, we look at more the salaries or how you're going to be able to provide for yourself and actually, you know, as to your point earlier, it's the relationships you make and the bonds you make in life that are most important in terms of, and your happiness. Interestingly, you know Happiness in childhood is a great predictor of happiness in adulthood. So you know, teaching our kids to be happy is super important And that's why you know, talking about play therapy and how you maybe you can just take us a little bit through what you do in the classrooms, becky, with play therapy and how, from my perspective, i'd love to learn like how play gets to the outcomes. You know that you're you know. How does that work? Is it magic?

Becky Hill Guest 29:15

Well, no, it's not magic. I think that's a nice thing as well, though, isn't it? Because there isn't a magic wand, and the key thing is about giving each child the time that they need and not, like we've just said, not rushing anything, whether that's developing the emotional regulation skills or whatever it is, or deciding what you want to be when you're an adult. But play, we obviously love play. it's at the heart of every intervention that we do. Play, i mean, you can, you can read, like the vast benefits of play. There are so many, but when we're thinking about therapy, it really is the child's natural language, and there's there's a, there's a psychologist called Carl Jung, and he talks about our psyche, so our unconscious, and the fact that it's actually self-healing, so we can actually self-heal by using metaphors and story and symbol, and this is what we create space for for children in therapy, which is kind of why we can't put you know, your, your child can receive 12 sessions and that will be it, because actually, the first thing is they need to create a relationship and then, once they've built this trust with the therapist, then they can go into exploring whatever it is that they need to explore, and children will, they'll make stories.

30:30

the play could be developmental, so it could be going right back to sort of these early stages of sensory play and they might move through something that maybe they missed in an early stage and need to to move through before they can move on and get to their current developmental stage.

30:44

Or it might be, you know, i guess, just as an example, if we take a story that a child has perhaps experienced domestic abuse in some way, and they might come into a session and utilise role play.

30:59

so role play is one we're embodying characters and creating story, and they might create a story where they're hiking up a mountain and there's there's a bear at the top of this mountain and their role is to try and tame this bear. And this bear is initially really scary and maybe they ask the therapist to be the bear, or maybe they use something in the room to be the bear, because at that point the bear is too scary. They could be, on this process of trying to befriend the bear, to tame the bear, maybe they are angry with the bear, maybe they get to a point where they actually can embody this bear and it can stop being quite so scary. So in that instance the bear could be and we don't always know because we don't ask them unless they choose to share it. but the bear could be representative of someone in their life that they've experienced scary or difficult experiences with, that they and they've used this creative process of play to come to terms with and process and also, i guess, become stronger than that experience.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 32:04

And it's fascinating and they, you know it's one of my other hats as a health coach and it's very similar. It's using them to find their own solutions. And it's interesting because in medicine you know, the way I was trained is we talk, we told people what to do. You know you take these pills, you do this, you do that and actually the results are terrible. Nobody takes their medication, nobody remembers what a doctor says in the doctor's office. It's all pretty much useless to a large degree, unless the patient is activated right. But if you do coaching and they come up with their own solutions and find their own pathway, then they'll take their medications, they'll do their lifestyle changes. But it has to come from the person And I, you know it sounds very similar. So you're getting the child to find their way to emotional well-being.

Becky Hill Guest 32:49

Absolutely, and that's why you can't put a timeline on it, And even you know when we're talking about children who are perhaps neurodiverse, and the really positive message is that just a small bit of play at home with their parent, where their parent is being really present and just watching and wondering and not So.

33:10

This is this is what we focus on a lot in parent. Child attachment play is supporting parents to engage in child led play with their child on a weekly basis And for some parents we start there at 15 minutes a week and we cap it at 12 weeks. The longer the better in terms of time span, but not necessarily session time. But you know this, this really small amount of time each week can have really positive benefits on that child's emotional well-being and on that relationship. And I guess it's like putting our trust in the fact that we don't have to see the changes in emotional regulation immediately. But if we can trust in the process and, you know, really put ourselves into it, we will see the benefits in time And we'll have a relationship that children can trust in, will be that person that they know they can come back to.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 33:58

It's amazing. You know, my mom used to have something called love time and it was 15 minutes every day She would give me and my brother. And when I got older she said to me she goes, olivia, sometimes I come home for work And the last thing in the world I wanted to do was to have that 15 minute love time with you and your brother. And so I mean and she worked quite a lot, but it was, it was our special time. So she's she's now passed, but it seems like she was ahead of her time in parenting And I, you know should should take a leaf out of her book of what you've said as well, because sometimes you just get too busy to take that time. So I think doing saying if you could do it once a week for 15 minutes and then build up, and then it makes it, it makes it doable.

Becky Hill Guest 34:36

So when we part of the work that we do is figuring out with parents and carers like, how do we find this time?

Because we're so busy, there's so much pressure on everyone to succeed in all different areas of life And it's hard. And then you also want to be a good parent and support your children And we start with a weekly session and then actually, if it's too much, then we quite often suggest that parents do it on the date day date of their child's birthday each month. So if they're born on the 12th every month, they have that time. We call it you and me time And it's the idea is that the time is in solely focused on whatever the child likes doing, and a really key thing as well is that the time is never taken away. So even if the child has had a really hard day, even if school of called and say that they've hit someone, they've thrown something at someone, we don't take that time, because the key thing is that that's what they really, really need is some time with an adult who can be there for them And that consistency that, no matter what, that they're there for them.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 35:39

That's beautiful And I think it really doable. You make it doable for parents. Well, it has been a real pleasure speaking to both of you today, and my mind's buzzing with things that I can do, and also to look and see where heart to heart groups are in my area, and I'm sure other parents are too, and they can go to your website, which I'll have on my website for people to access. And I like to ask my guests at the end of the show are there three top tips that you guys, between the two of you, would like to share with? what is the real takeaway message that parents can get from this conversation today?

Becky Hill Guest 36:18

Absolutely Anna would you? like to go first or?

Anna Hodgson Guest 36:20

Well, just reflecting on what you were talking about just now, becky, i would say, as I've changed my opinion. Before we started the conversation I had some ideas, but actually I'm going to say that I think parents should just remember to keep playing, because we stop playing, don't we, when we stop being kids, and actually you know play is just so healthy and so good for you and you know it makes you feel great. So we do have on the website a wonderful parents play kit that Becky put together a couple of years ago pre-pandemic which is, i think, about 98 pages of ideas of how to play really, really simple things that you can do with your kids at home with just stuff that's around the house that you know is simple, kind of very quick, 15 minute games, and it's brilliant. So I'd encourage people to go take a look and download it for free and keep playing.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 37:09

I love that. Excellent, That's a great tip. I'm going to take you up on that tip actually.

Becky Hill Guest 37:13

It's great, isn't it? Because play, for like children, fights for its place in society, so let alone as adults. But even just off the back of Anna's tip there, i guess the more playful we can be, the more playful energy it gives us. And being playful in our communication with children is, you know, children. When we become authoritarian, children put their guard up and they don't want to communicate, whereas when we can be playful, it creates for a much more fluid relationship.

There's a wonderful pace model that's about being playful, accepting, curious and empathic, and it's thank yous for anyone who's interested. It's a lovely way to communicate with your children and just trying to be a bit more like I'm going to be a storyteller in this communication when we think about that thing that went really, really wrong for you today and I'm here and I'm interested and I want to know what happened rather than I'm really mad at you for that thing that we did today. Sometimes guards go straight up or as if we can go, do you know what? let's even bake some cakes whilst we have a chat about that thing. That was really hard for you today, because I'm your parent and I'm here.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 38:16

That's lovely. That's another great tip as well, and then we had the tip from earlier as well, becky.

Becky Hill Guest 38:23

Yeah.

So we kind of already we talked about the good enough theory and the tip, you know, just to release the pressure and know that you only need to be good enough as well as would really encourage creating some weekly quality time with your child doing something that they enjoy, so whether that's playing a game or baking some cakes, or it might even be going for a walk together, or, if your child's older, it could be going for a coffee or getting your nails done or going on a bike ride.

Something else, though, that I would really encourage and Anna and I were talking about our rainbow values earlier is about one of our values is to never give up, and I think something that can be really hard is when your children or child learns differently and they're in a classroom that's designed to only teach in a certain way And that's no judgment on teachers, because classrooms are hard and you have so many children who are coming from all different angles of different ways of learning, with different energies But to not give up on fighting for what your child needs, because something that we really learn in these groups of parents is that the more that they learn about the child, the more that they can share with other adults supporting them, and it's really important that your child gets you know whether, whatever it is five minutes extra time outside before coming back in the classroom, something that the permission to draw whilst the teacher is talking, because that helps them to focus.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 39:51

Yeah, it's a. It's a never give up. I actually on episode 20, that's a song my daughter actually wrote about. She's made a song. It's actually the music in our in the podcast is about never giving up, and it's a song she and my dad wrote together about how never giving up as a child, and in the episode I talk about how it's so important never to give up as a parent as well, because you have to. You're the you're the one that's going to help to find those solutions in school. You're the one that's you know, you're, you're the warrior for your child And sometimes, because of the way the education system is currently set up, it is necessary to be a warrior for your child. So I totally and utterly agree with that last top tip. Now you guys are having a conference in October in Oxford which is all about play therapy. Well, i'll get you to tell me what it's all about, because I'm sure, like myself, there are going to be other parents listening who would love to come and learn more.

Anna Hodgson Guest 40:44

Yeah so our conference is something that we've been hoping to do for a good number of years actually. So Clare Sky was now 14 years old this year And we missed our 10th anniversary because of the lockdown. But we promised excuse me, we promised our network that we do a conference and get everybody together. So primarily the conferences for family practitioners and people working to support families, and they often are quite isolated, working out on their own in you know, all different parts of the UK And in fact we've got members and partners who work overseas as well.

So the conference in October is an opportunity for those people to come together to support one another, to talk about how we can all move forward as a body, to sort of champion the power of play and to really be kind of on top of our game. One of the things that we also get involved with as a charity is kind of contributing to a lot of consultation papers and papers and reports that go to government really to, because what we want to do is to, you know, make sure that this is sort of top on the agenda, that children's mental health and emotional wellbeing is important as part of you know how society moves forward and grows. You know mental health and emotional support is an expensive part of our economy. So you know, we know that early intervention is important. So the conference is about supporting that message and supporting those people that work towards supporting kids and families.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 42:12

Okay, so not really for parents, but more for the caregivers of parents.

Anna Hodgson Guest 42:15

But that's fabulous Well for caregivers, yeah.

Dr Olivia Kessel Host 42:18

Yeah, but there's lots of support on your website for parents, including that 98 page manual of how to play, which sounds fantastic, becky, and then also links to, as you said, to be able to search for a postcode for where you could find the play therapy groups, the heart to heart sessions, in your area. So that's a great resource as well for parents.

Anna Hodgson  Guest 42:40

Yeah, and we put more and more resources out on the website as well, don't we? Becky, as we create them? Becky's brilliant at just inventing wonderful games and activities and things that we pop on there for people to download. So, yeah, do take a look.

Dr Olivia Kessel

Excellent. Well, thank you both so much for joining us today. It's been a real pleasure to talk to you And I'm excited to go and implement some of the things I've learned today with my daughter. So, thank you, thanks, so much. Thank you for listening. Send parenting tribe. I found this episode super useful and I hope you did too. I personally have three actions I'm going to take away. I'm going to create some mean you time consistently with my daughter each week. I'm going to download the free parents play kit And I'm also going to look into a heart to heart course in my area. All of this information will be available to you on our website, www.sendparenting.com, and there will be links in the episode for you to access. Wishing you and your family a week filled with play Till next Tuesday.