Transcript - Episode Two

Exploring a specialist school setting, The Unicorn, with Head Mr Day

Please excuse any errors as this transcript has been automatically generated

Dr Kessel:

Welcome to the Send Parenting Podcast, focused on supporting and empowering parents and their Neurodiverse children. I'm your Neurodiverse host, Dr. Olivia Kessel. We'll be speaking weekly with experts in the S.E.N.D World. No topic is too big or too small for us to discuss. We will include things like, how do you navigate education? How can you understand what your child's legal rights are to an education? Practical advice on neurodiversity, and most importantly, hearing the voices of other parents just like you. Looking forward to having you join US Weekly as part of the Send Parenting Tribe.

Dr Kessel:

In this episode, we're gonna speak with Mr. Andrew Day, head of the Unicorn School since 2015. The Unicorn is a specialist independent day school for children age seven to 16 years who have specific educational needs, and it's located in Abingdon in Oxfordshire. They offer both primary and secondary education, including a GCSE program. Mr. Day really has a passion for supporting children who struggle at school. His teaching career spans 30 years. 16 of those have been spent working in specialist educational school settings. In our interview today, we'll explore the unicorn as a school and also look at is a specialist school right for you and your child? What are the rules and of assessments in helping you to determine that? What is an EHCP and how does a specialist school navigate GCSEs to name, but a few of the topics we get into in this insightful and engaging episode.

Dr Kessel:

So, welcome Mr. Day. It's a real honor to have you on the Send Parenting Podcast. And actually, you are our first guest, if you can believe it. So it's really exciting to have you here today. I remember meeting you about two and a half years ago, just before Covid with my, coming to your school. I had many doors slammed in my face in terms of finding a school for Alexandra. Even the school she was in, her private school that she was in at the time. She was eight years old. I remember sitting in your office and you gave me hope. You gave me hope that actually there was a place that would realize my daughter's potential. And it was, it was inspiring. I have to thank you for that. So I'm really happy that you're here today to share with everyone else your passion for kids and, and them reaching their potentials. Now, you've been in education for 30 years, um, and I believe it's 16 of that has been in special education. Can you tell me a little bit about what brought you on this journey? What, what made you move from mainstream to a specialist school?

Mr. Andrew Day:

No, absolutely. I started teaching way back in 1992, and I was fortunate. I had a job in a highly selective grammar school and for seven years, the teaching flew by the head mistress was very keen to get me, because I was a very sporty young man, believe it or not, then and she actually promised me rugby coaching three afternoons of the week and cricket. I found myself, and it sounds terrible thing to, to say, I found myself getting bored in the classroom because these kids were as bright as anything. I mean anybody could teach them whatever I threw at them, they could take on board. And I found myself really gravitating towards, the less able children or the children actually who were as able as the others but because of a learning difference, they needed a little bit extra support.

Mr. Andrew Day:

So, I persuaded my wife. We were living in Bristol at the time, and her family were, all in and around Bristol. So I persuaded my wife it was time to move. And after seven years, I took a job as a director of studies at a dyslexia specialist school. And I'll never forget the first class I walked in and they were verbally as strong as the class I'd taught before at the grammar school. And I thought, oh, this is gonna be the same. And then when I asked them to put their ideas down on paper, I suddenly realized, wow, okay, what am I doing wrong here? Because these incredibly verbal, bright children, getting the ideas down was, you know, really, really difficult for them. And I spent three really, really happy years there teaching these children. And what amazes me, this was just across the, millennium.

Mr. Andrew Day:

So it was 1999 to 2002. And even then, we had children working on laptops and taking the laptops to the printer at the back of this of the room, with an infrared beam. And then they were printing their work out then. And I was thinking, whoa, I think that's 20 years ago. This is the future. This is what it's going to be like. We had our children in London at the time. We had our children there and my wife was keen to have the support of the family. That's a real, and it was really reluctantly we left and we moved back and the only job I could get was back into a mainstream school. I really missed it the specialist setting. And I did again grab onto and I'd take the, uh, the less able groups and I'd really plow everything into them.

Mr. Andrew Day:

And then, my first headship came about and it was in a school very similar to the Unicorn School for children with specific learning differences. I absolutely loved it. And the seven years there flew by, you know, as my first headship. I really, really enjoyed it. It was just that opportunity I wanted, I am quite passionate, and being able to share that passion with the team and motivate the team to, to work around it. I was approached by the chair of Governors at the Unicorn and he sold me on the plans about extending the school, moving up to offer GCSE. I was quite happy becasue the children were settled and it was a case of look, just come and see. And once I came and saw the children and met the children, you know, again, I was sold and had the big sell of life trying to persuade my wife <laugh>. It was time to move again. <laugh>.

Dr Kessel:

And you were obviously successful,

Mr. Andrew Day:

<laugh>. Yes, no, absolutely. But you know, you obviously know the, the school really well and, once you get in and actually meet the children, that's what makes the huge difference. And there should be hundreds of schools like the Unicorn readily available around the country. You know, it's heartbreaking when we are full, now we are at capacity and picture the scene, you know, if you came to visit me now, I'd be saying, look, maybe next September, maybe we can help her next September. And that's really hard for parents because you know, the children are struggling now and they need the help. Now

Dr Kessel:

What type of, I mean how many people are you able to enroll per year and does it depend on what grade they're in, when they come to the unicorn in terms of when they can get accepted or not accepted? When are the best times to try and get into a school like yours?

Mr. Andrew Day:

Well, to give you an idea, we have about 20 places a year. So we've got 11 children at the top of the school. 11, 12 children at the top of the school. And they'll move on, they'll go into local sixth forms. Then we'll have about nine or 10 children throughout the school who will then move back to mainstream, because the goal of the school is very much to try and get children back into mainstream, that's where we hang out hat on. So we've got about 20 spaces now. The last three years, we've had over 250 parental inquiries a year for those 20 or so places. And to give you an idea, we are in November now, so since September the first, we've had 110 this term. So the numbers are just going through the roof. So the best, opportunities, the younger the child, the better to bridge the gap.

Mr. Andrew Day:

If they come to us a little bit later, the gap just gets wider and wider and it's harder, for us to close those gaps. Also, their own self-esteem, starts to go through the floor and their own belief in who they are. We have to try and work on that side, as well. So the younger the child the better. But, we have a huge interest in particular in secondary education. I think primary schools are getting better and prep schools are getting better across protecting a child. They may not be able to meet the child's needs, but they are able to protect them all. And parents are worried because they're looking at the horizon as sort of a 1200 strong, 1500 strong pupil secondary school and the thought of sending their child there. So yes, we're having a huge interest into the secondary part of the Unicorn.

Dr Kessel:

It's interesting also because I think, you know, there's a journey that I took as a parent in terms of not understanding that my child wasn't doing well in school and there was journey there. And then, you know, luckily the headmaster let me know that she didn't see my daughter being able to complete upper school. I guess I wasn't aware of exactly what her special education needs are. How does a parent know that a specialist school is the right school for them? And I know that when I brought my daughter to your school, she had some assessments done there. I hadn't done any assessments myself. I now have done more assessments. Can you explain that to me a bit more because it is confusing when you're in primary school trying to understand what is the best route for your child?

Mr. Andrew Day:

No, absolutely. I had parents in this week, so prospective parents came around this week and one of them asked me that exact same question, how do I know that, you know, my child needs to come here. And my answer was quite simply, well come, come with me now and we'll go and meet the children. The answer is, can you picture your child here? And when they come, they suddenly realize, well, you know, and it's a horrible term to use. Well these children are normal and I'm normal, but it's true. You know, and they, they worry about, you know, because every parent wants their child to go to a mainstream school to go to the local primary or prep school and then the local secondary school, that's their goal. That's all they want for their child. And it's hard for them.

Mr. Andrew Day:

And especially when you talk about a school where we've got a speech language therapist, we've got two occupational therapists, we've got creative art therapy and they're think, well, why does my child need to go there? And it's only when they come and actually meet the children and realize, wow, these kids are great. And it's actually hearing the child's voice because I do ask the children, you know, what's different about their old school and the Unicorn? What do you think you've improved most? And I ask, why, you know, what is it that we do differently, uh, here? And it's when they hear the child's voice that carries so much more weight than, you know, anything they hear from me or anything they read on the website it is hearing that child's voice.

Dr Kessel:

Yeah, no, it's very powerful. I felt that way when I visited the school as well. And you know, although the school is, known, dyslexic, dyspraxic, dyscalculia, you have a wide variety of different neurodiverse conditions in the school, you know, from autism to ADHD to cerebral palsy but you do have a quite a strong selection process in terms of who can benefit from the unicorn and who maybe can't benefit from the unicorn.

Mr. Andrew Day:

Yeah, no, absolutely, a typical dyslexic profile is this spiky profile. So you've got some real strengths you can teach to, and then there are areas, there are troughs and areas that they find difficult. But we know we can teach them. And I am honest to all parents and I'll say, look, if we do an assessment and all the scores are on the floor, then this child is working at a level actually they're capable of working at. So we look at their underlying cognitive ability and we see if there are spikes in there. The other way we are selective and you need to understand we've got 12 vulnerable learners in each class and it's really hard for them. So if a child comes in and starts picking up chairs and throwing chairs around the room, you know, our children, they're gonna be affected more than say, a more robust, learner.

Mr. Andrew Day:

They can't switch off what's happening in one side of the room, and carry on with what they're doing. So it's my promise to all parents, we won't take a child whose actions will impact on the learning of the other children in the class. And that may be that actually they've taken up much more time of the TA because, you know, we are quite fortunate there's 12 children, there's a teacher and a TA, but if one's taken all the time of the TA, it's not fair on the other, children in there. So we are quite honest, it's actually for prospective parents. It's quite a relief for them to, to understand that we are not an emotional behavioral unit and that we are not set up to take children with those difficulties.

Dr Kessel:

Yeah and that's for the greater good of the population that you already have. That's totally understandable. But you guys do work with let's say not so much as challenging behavior, but you do do a lot of emotional support, within the school. And I know that we've had previous discussions about getting children assessed and the waiting list for getting children assessed. What are your views on parents in terms of getting external assessments or getting, you know, either privately or also, you know, through the CAM system or other systems out there?

Mr. Andrew Day:

Oh look, the NHS systems on its knees at the moment, the delay for CAMS, I think somebody said the latest is three years. I just can't fathom that it's going take three years from an initial inquiry to get a child assessed for ADHD or , autism. So, you know, it's really difficult because for the majority of parents, they can't afford to go and have a private assessment then, becasue we are talking upwards of 1500 pounds upwards to nearly 2000 pounds now to, to have an assessment. So we try and help as much as possible and actually we try and reduce the cost. So if a child now has come with an up-to-date assessment, then there's no need for us to do a full assessment. Because if they've come with an ed psychs report, we are not going to find anything different from that ed psychs report. Now I know in your case we actually undertook all the assessments ourselves and for you that was really insightful. Just to give you an idea of, you know, the underlying, again, the underlying cognitive ability, the potential for the charts, that's what the school's all here is here for is to help the child achieve their potential

Dr Kessel:

Because there's kind of a catch 22, you know, as a parent you're like, is my child, to use your phrase as well, normal. And you know, is there, is there more to this picture that I'm not seeing? You have an indication of it and, I'm a doctor and I still kind of didn't see the signs and the school I was in didn't help me with that aspect of it. It was a constant battle. But getting that assessment from you guys was really, really helpful for me to understand where she is and where she can go. It's almost like parents have to think about it before it's actually come into their minds to get on the waiting list to be able to have the proper assessment. It is a somewhat broken system for parents, who might be delayed anyway in terms of facing the reality, I guess that is a way of putting it

Mr. Andrew Day:

<laugh>. No, no, absolutely. And look, there are great schools out there for children with real severe learning difficulties, you know, global difficulties. And then there's mainstream and then there's this huge gap that goes between this real, real specialist provision and mainstream and local authorities' view is, and the actually not just local, it's the government's view is that everybody's needs can be met in mainstream apart from this tiny percentage who need that real specialist. And that's just not the case. And we know we've had children who've come to us, who've been off school, they've been the last six months, 12 months, uh, out of the school education system because they cannot cope in a large mainstream class with 25, 30 children. The movement around from class to class, the noise and so on. My heart goes out to them because of chronic under-funding over a number of years. The schools don't have the staff, you know, I'm incredibly fortunate. I've got myself, we've got two Emotional learning supprot or two teaching assistants out the front every morning just to help those children who are having a wobble. They've had a wobble overnight just to help them to come in. Now the majority of schools, they can't have that, they don't have the resources to be able to do that. So, you know, I'm just incredibly fortunate that at our school we've got the staffing and the expertise to be able to support our children.

Dr Kessel:

Yeah, because I think the desire to have kids in mainstream, I've heard that there's schools up north, I don't know if you've heard of them, were they have a mainstream school next to a specialist school like the Unicorn where they have the small classrooms and they have the same setup that they have at the Unicorn and then they share with the mainstream school, theater, art, recess. Sometimes you know, if they're able to, and that benefits both sides, but it doesn't impact the learning of either group becasue just like you said, you know, someone who has a, really bad behavioral issues can be a distraction can someone in a mainstream setting with special education needs to be a distraction for the mainstream kids. So it's a kind of in my view, maybe a good halfway house. But we don't seem to have many of those types of schools.

Mr. Andrew Day:

No, and the problem is they are heavily oversubscribed. There's a school, for instance, near us where they've got a unit, an autism unit, but that's already full for next September. So they've already lined up the children to go in there. There's one near Newbury with a dyslexia center but again, that is really oversubscribed and we've got children here and because the children here have benefited from a year or two years at this school, the mainstream is saying, well they don't need that sort of level of support because there are other children who haven't benefited from the sort of level of support we've had here. And they're going in at a far lower level.

Dr Kessel:

That's interesting. So they actually feel that they've had already their dyslexia training. So make room for another student to get that opportunity. How many students actually go back to mainstream? You'd mentioned that that's part of the ethos of the Unicorn. What, what kind of numbers actually go back and successfully, adapt to mainstream after being at the Unicorn?

Mr. Andrew Day:

So, it used to be the case that half my year six would, uh, go back into local secondary schools. They'd go back in. and then, because we were traditionally a prep school, about a third of my year would also move in. A lot of our parents have been really successful in fighting the system and actually getting their child's place here now funded by different local authorities and they're less likely to leave, because they know they've got the funding in place until the child leaves at the end of a year 11. And they don't want to risk the child going back into a mainstream class and not having the level of support. And actually we've been quite successful <laugh> in getting some really great, GCSE grades, for our year 11 levers.

Mr. Andrew Day:

And the parents are seeing those and realizing, wow, okay, we can keep them on until the end of year 11 and then they can leave us with the relevant GCSEs they need so that they can either carry on about half my children will carry on the academic route and do A levels and then University if that's what they want. And the other half will go to local Sixth form colleges and do more vocational courses. But knowing they've got their maths, their English, their science GCSEs behind them so that they can go in at a much higher level so they can pursue their dreams and not have to reset maths or English or whatever else they have to do.

Dr Kessel:

Now, can you, can you take us through the GCSEs and, and how it differs from mainstream school because it is, it is a unique way of setting up kids with learning difficulties for success.

Mr. Andrew Day:

Yes. So all the way up to year eight, the children get daily one-to-one, uh, sessions. So it's 30 minutes a day with their own dedicated one-to-one teacher. And this helps massively from the younger children, um, teaching them the breaking down words, how to read, how to write, how to get their ideas done. And then as they get older, we look at, uh, using technology to support the children. So we teach them to touch type for some children it'll be using voice to text. We are a Microsoft Showcase school and we know that, you know, we are well into the 21st century now this is going to be the best way forward for our children to learn. So we move from that way of working to key stage four. And we look at year nine, year 10 and year 11 as a three year process to get them through the GCSEs.

Mr. Andrew Day:

At this point, all the children are using their surface pros or surface go as their main way of learning. So this is their normal way of working now. And they've had all the one-to-one support to help them get there. And all their lessons are on their laptops. And this means when they come to sit the actual GCSE exams, they actually sit them on examination laptops where we download the papers onto there. Now they might, if they're doing a science paper and a math paper, they might have that paper next to them and they might be able to answer the short answers on the actual papers. But the longer answers, they can then go onto their laptops and type out their answers

Dr Kessel:

They do, sorry to interrupt. Can they do dictation as well on that?

Mr. Andrew Day:

Yes, absolutely. Depends on the GCSE. Obviously English, they can't because of the English language papers still marked on spelling on the side of things. But on the other papers they can still use dictation, uh, on there. The whole goal is to make these children independent. I don't want them to leave the school still relying on a lovely gentleman or a lovely lady sat next to them, scribing for them, reading for them. I want them to be able to do this themselves so the children are using the exam read pen so that they can actually read. And, you know, when you're 15 and 16, you don't want to have somebody sat next to you, you help <laugh>, you wanna be able to do it yourself. So we give them the skills, we give them the tools to be able to fly.

Mr. Andrew Day:

And again, you know, we have 12 children in a class, but the ability range in that 12 can be massive. So we've got some really, really bright children that we can then split the maths group into two or three sets where the more able we can really push, because maths is an area where children can fly at and they could be the ones getting those GCSE eight or even the nines, but then we celebrate that small cohort who, for them a four, well that is their equivalent of a nine. So if we can get them up to that four, then wow, we've done brilliantly. And that child has done brilliantly. But again, sad, it comes down to staffing and it comes down to having the ability to be able to have such small sets that we really able to help each child achieve their potential.

Dr Kessel:

Yeah, absolutely. And and I can imagine for the children in terms of their emotional wellbeing and their mental health, that that is a totally different, ballpark to what they would be experiencing if they were going through the GCSEs in a mainstream school.

Mr. Andrew Day:

Oh, and look Olivia, the GCSE results come out sort of mid August, on a Thursday. It's for me the best day of the year because everybody's happy and they're happy because we've talked, we've worked with the parents with the child and we've made sure they've all gone into the right level of exam. And this might mean that they're doing the higher tier papers and they're going for those sevens eight to nines. They might be going for the foundation level tiers where they can get a level four or level five as their top grade. But the alternative is they might be doing the functional skills or they might be doing the entry level GCSEs because we don't want to set our children for failure. So we want them to know they can succeed at whatever level they go in at. And it just means when it comes to results day, they already basically, they already know what they're gonna be getting and they know they've got the grades they want for their next course at Sixth Form College or at their A level college, whatever course they're going to do.

Dr Kessel:

All of those different routes are a success, which is, which is what's brilliant. You know, it's not just one pathway that's success. There are many roads to a successful life.

Mr. Andrew Day:

No, absolutely. And look, we, we scour the different examination boards. You know, as I said, there's 12 children in the class. We actually use six different examination boards because we can find the best one for our children. And, you know, for, for mathematics that might be the Cambridge GCSE because they're, instead of doing three papers, uh, one of which is a non calculated paper, they do two papers, both of which are calculated papers. And for our children who are discalculic who have been trying to learn their tables since they've been six and now they're 16 and they still don't know their tables, they can actually know they've got a huge crutch with them in that they've got a calculator. Now they don't realize that because there's two calculated papers, the questions are actually much harder, but actually give them the calculator and all of a sudden the confidence they have they fly through it. And it's the same with the English or, you know, my wife actually teaches the food nutrition and we use the Welsh Joint Education Board paper because 60% of that is coursework. And for our children, that means they're not relying on one exam at the end of a three year course. You know, they can actually work throughout the whole whole period to be able to give themselves the best chance of success.

Dr Kessel:

Well, I'm, I'm amazed to hear that they still check spelling because I'm dyslexic and I still can't spell, I'm so thankful to Microsoft Word because it corrects my grammar. I can't spell and <laugh> I'll never be able to spell. So, hopefully in the future they'll exempt people from spelling.,

Mr. Andrew Day:

Well, absolutely. And look, it's our 30th anniversary and we've had past, pupils come back. We've had sort of specialists with dyslexia teach talk to the children. And we had one guy, Adam, who's a lawyer, and he says he dictates everything into his Dictaphone and then he gives it to his PA who types it all up. And he sits down just like you are now with his headphones on and he'll press the button and his emails are read to him and he'll dictate his reply straight into there. And look, Olivia, you know, if I use my daughter as an example, now my daughter's dyslexic, she's dyscalculia and she has ADHD. So as with often with many of our children, it's not just one thing impacting, there's lots of things. And Hannah was at the local,secondary school where she literally scraped enough GCSEs to go do a n A level and we celebrate.

Mr. Andrew Day:

She got a five in maths and we celebrated like nothing, you know, as if she had sort of 9 or 10 in it. A levels she started to flourish because actually she chose three subjects she had a real passion for, she'd always been put into the bottom sets with children who had no interest in, in learning and actually were being disruptive in class. So that had a real impact on her. Now she was in sixth form and actually she was with children with similar interests who wanted to learn, and I'll never forget this, she, she did extremely well at A Levels and she went to Bath Spa University and in the first week, uh, they did a student disability assessment on her and they gave her an hour a week with a dyslexic tutor to help her set out her assignments. They gave her a laptop, they downloaded all the texts she needed onto a laptop and then they had an IT specialist to sit down with her to go through all of that.

Mr. Andrew Day:

And I was thinking, this is fantastic. Where was it when she was six form<laugh> when she had the upset stomach when she didn't want to go to school. She was dull, she was thick. These are her lines that she was coming out with, where was the support there? And it's a real shame becasue if you can get through to them, it's sounds bizarre, but the GCSEs are the hardest set of exams to get through because it's such a wide range that you still have to focus in. Once you get through that you can then fly because you can choose your A level subjects or you can choose your vocational course that is a real passion for, and then you can fly with it.

Dr Kessel:

It's interesting that there's much more support in university than there is in secondary school or, or primary school quite frankly as well. It seems to be putting the cart before the horse so to speak, you know?

Mr. Andrew Day:

No, absolutely. And look, we've got one of our governors, um, Maria Frost, she's actually dyslexia, autism tutor at Oxford University. So even at Oxford, and you can imagine the grades, the young adults would need to get to get to a, an institute like Oxford and then she's there to be able to help support them at that level. So even at, you know, Oxford, Cambridge, the tutors are there to be able to support the children,

Dr Kessel:

Which is fantastic. You had mentioned also that a lot of the kids in the school myself included, have gone through the process of getting an an EHCP. It's a challenging process. I'd love to get your thoughts on what, you know, when should a parent think about going through an E H C P when you know when is the right time? Did you go through one with your daughter?

Mr. Andrew Day:

No, I think the first bit of advice is roll your sleeves up, uh, and get ready for a fight.

Dr Kessel:

<laugh>, that's, that's good. Good advice. Yeah.

Mr. Andrew Day:

<laugh> and look and my heart does go because look, I was state educated. I went through teach training college with a view, you know, I wanted to make a difference. I started teaching as I said in 1992, you know, and education system was, was on its knees, for because of years of chronic underfunding. And we've almost come full circle and we are back to that same situation now. And they, I'm, I've got colleagues who are head teachers in state schools and they're saying to support the 5% pay increase. They've been told they have to do it within their same budget. So there's teachers getting a 5% and no, I'm telling you now, teachers deserve double treble that as a pay increase. But to meet the 5% they've had to do it within the same budget. So they've gotta get rid of stuff to be able to pay.

Mr. Andrew Day:

The other staff and the staff are gonna go are the TAs and these are the ones, and we, I describe 'em as the glue in each class who are able to just stick everybody together and make sure everybody's there to be able to support. They're having to get rid of these. You know, we've got teachers in school whose partners are teaching in local primary schools where they've got classes of 30, 32 children. They may get a TA one afternoon, two afternoons, they've got five children with educational healthcare plans. They've got children with English as their second language and they're supposed to meet the needs here. So schools are really stretched and they're really struggling to be able to support. So for the children, our children who need a little bit of extra, you've got to go and you've gotta a role and you've gotta fight.

Mr. Andrew Day:

And my daughter, Hannah, I was actually a governor at the local primary school with Hannah and I went to the teacher and said, oh look, we, we think she's dyslexic. What sort of support can you give her? And the teacher knew I was head of an SEND school and knew I was the SEN governor of the school. And she came back and said, oh no, you're just comparing her to her sister. Don't worry, she's absolutely fine. She's coping really well. And we then, because obviously my wife is an SEND teacher as well. So we did our own assessments. We came back and said, look, this is what we found, what can you do? And they said, well look, actually we, we can give her 30 minute a week with the lovely TA. Now we knew the TA was a mum in the village and she was a lovely person, but she had no qualification, she had no training, she had the experience of being in that class.

Mr. Andrew Day:

But, that was about it. It's really, really difficult because as a governor I want to support the school, but then I'm also a dad and I wanted to support my daughter and it's what we do to support them as well. So it is really sleeves up, fight, write to the local authority. You ask for an assessment, they'll turn you down and they'll say no, she doesn't meet the needs to be assessed. Even you then write again and they give you a certain amount of weeks to appeal. There are charities to help SENDIASS, there are other charities who can support you with this battle. Obviously the other alternative. But again, it's only if you can afford it, there's the legal route where you can get an educational lawyer behind you and they're excellent because they can hold the local authority to account and they can keep them to the timescales because otherwise the timescales will just keep slipping and slipping and slipping and it'll take longer and longer. It may well end up going to tribunal, but what's really worrying me is that we are already getting dates for tribunals for October, 2023 and we are in November 2022 now. So we're looking at almost a year because there's such a backlog, from these tribunals. So yes, unfortunately it is a fight, but just persevere.

Dr Kessel:

It's a broken system isn't it? Yeah, it's a real broken system. Um, before we, we end our chat today, Mr. Day, I'd also like to just have a sneak peek maybe of the Phoenix School, which is something on the horizon. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Mr. Andrew Day:

No, absolutely. And it comes back down to our start of our conversation when I said we get 250 to 300 inquiries. Now, if I'm honest, about 100f those, inquiries for Unicom places we are not set up. They need even far more level of support than even we can offer. And that's where the sort of the seeds of the idea of a Phoenix school, so a sister school to the Unicorn, which specializes in teaching children, where autism is their main learning barrier, if you like. So that's where we are looking at. It sadly comes down to finding location. We want it to be relatively close to where we are now. So within sort of a 20 minute drive, any pieces of land in Oxfordshire is currently being used for housing <laugh>. So, and they can make a lot more money from housing than selling it to a lovely charity like us.

Mr. Andrew Day:

But we are persevering and we are trying to find that spot where we can open up and look. We've, we've been in discussions with Oxford and all the other local authorities because we have children funded by Buckinghamshire Shire and Redding and Hampshire, uh, Wiltshire, all of these. And they're really keen because there's no provision. And to give you an idea, you know, from a conversation with Oxford, they admitted that there's 420 children they send out of county for support. Now that's just massive and that doesn't include the number of children who are currently not in education. They didn't have the figures to be able to share that. So there is such a need out there and I know once we get Phoenix up and open, then I am looking for a Unicorn 2,3 , 4.

Dr Kessel:

Well, you know, I think anyone can do it you can do it

Dr Kessel:

There is a saying in Africa you can only eat an elephant one bite at a time. So I guess the Phoenix School is your first bite, but I'm sure it won't be your last <laugh>. Well, good. You keep them to count. Well, it's been a real pleasure speaking with you today.

Mr. Andrew Day:

Today I may Governor en no at all, always a pleasure. Thank you.

Dr Kessel:

Thank you. Send Parenting Tribe for listening to our first interview podcast with Mr. Day from the Unicorn School. Please make sure you subscribe to the show so you can catch up with us weekly, as I'll be bringing you the most amazing people from around the globe to talk to us about sends parenting, supporting you with knowledge and expertise one step at a time.

Dr Kessel:

One thing I'd really like you to do after listening to this episode is to visit us@sendparenting.com. You will find more information about what we've discussed in each of the episodes and also links to our social media platforms so that you can leave messages and comments about what topics you would like to explore Next on the Send Parenting Podcast, please also make sure to tune in next week when we speak with Mr. Adam Friel from j Dodd's law Firm, who brings his unique neurodiverse lens to educational law. We'll discuss his journey being severely dyslexic, also his son's journey with autism, and then we'll get into the nitty gritty of the e HCP process and navigating the local authority. Look forward to you joining us next week. Bye for now.